Balancing Support and Accountability with Jason Shelangouski

RS 52 Jason Shelangouski
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[00:00:00] Welcome to the Resilient Schools Podcast. I'm here , , at the Bridging to Resilience, , conference here in Wichita, Kansas. , we're recording live on location, which is always fun. I've got here with me Jason Shellingowski. Welcome, Jason. Thanks for being here.

thanks , will you start by telling us a little bit about yourself?

I currently teach at Wamego Middle School in Wamego, Kansas, and teach 8th grade language arts, and also creative writing, and then in the second half of the year, leadership as an elective.

, 16th year in education, and all 16 years I've been teaching middle school.

Ah, best place to be. Middle school is awesome.

Anybody who doesn't think that, it just hasn't learned yet. That's

it's usually a very interesting interaction with people when they ask you what you do. And you tell them you teach middle school, they tend to, , look at you a little bit

you a little bit

because they know what you have to be able to handle and work with as well,

Yeah, the amazing thing [00:01:00] about it is that you get a whole new group of students every single day. Oh yeah, absolutely. And, the hormones, the changes they're going through just make them brand new people every day. And so you never know which kid's going to walk through the door that day.

That's right. And I make sure to meet them at the door to know which ones I am going to get, , for sure,

Yeah, that's good. , so I want to talk about this idea of co regulation, which, , we've heard a lot about at this conference, , and we've talked about self regulation a lot. Define the difference between self regulation and co regulation.

For me, , and the stuff that I've studied and looked at, I feel like asking middle school kids to just self regulate it's a great goal, , it's a great idea, , to get them to learn how to, regulate their own feelings, but I feel like at middle school, because it's maybe the strangest time in a kid's life, there has to be some co regulation, which means that, both myself and the child, or the administrator and the child have to learn to work [00:02:00] together to make sure that they, Can self regulate or you know if they need that moment to do it together to co regulate

I've been Really looking at my mannerisms quite a bit in terms of like my facial reactions and things To middle school kids because I feel like if I'm going to try to co regulate with them and try to get them Whether it's calmed down or focused back in I need to not be what they currently are.

I need to be a calming voice for them or I need to be a stern reminder to them in order to get them back into class because there's like you said there's a million different ways a kid could come in middle school each day and it's not going to be good practice just to try and guess that.

A lot of times you have to work together with them in order to get them to

see that Whatever it is they're dealing with, coping with, they don't have to do it alone.

Yeah. And you said something interesting there that you have to either be , a calm, [00:03:00] soothing voice or you need to be a stern.

Direct voice, like there is a different time and a place for having those different approaches and, and sometimes people misinterpret those to mean something that they're not when, you know the kid, you know what they need and how they're going to respond. , , , I coach school principals, and leaders about like how to be.

a better leader, right? And that's what I focus on. And one of the things that I sometimes do is I call people out and make them cry. And other times I am very empathetic and understanding and you have to know where the balance is with that. How do you determine that and how do you figure that out for yourself?

For me, I think it's a combination of a couple of things. One, I'm also a coach. And I think sometimes that takes a bad rap in education, that if you're a coach, that that's what you're there for. And coaching to me has always [00:04:00] been a byproduct.

The classroom is where I'm most impactful, but coaching is right up there, and I feel like that has helped me quite a bit in the classroom, because in coaching, you do have to know your athletes, and not every single one of them can be coached the same. It's just a factor of there's some kids that you can get after and then there's some kids that you need to put your arm around them and explain things differently.

And I take that same approach with teaching. The other thing that I think matters the most is support from your administration. And right now I've never probably received more support from administration than I do right now at WAMIGO. , our principal, , Brad Kuchar , is second to none in terms of principals, Assistant Principal Brian McIntosh.

They're just very supportive individuals and then it goes right up the chain from there with our Assistant Superintendent Scott Meitler and then Rob McKim is our Superintendent. And quite honestly, none of us ever feel like, or at least we don't at the middle school, feel like We're making the wrong choice, and if we do, we just get to talk about it with them and figure it out and try to make better choices the [00:05:00] next time, rather than feeling like, the hammer's coming down on you.

And I think that helps teachers in the classroom as well, because if you don't, if you don't have the hammer coming down on you all the time, and you get to talk things out, then there's no reason you can't do the same thing

with those

school kids.

Yeah, that, that's so powerful because leadership is so important in the day to day scheme. And that, that perfectly summarizes why it's so valuable because you react to the pressure that you feel. Oh, whether that's light pressure or heavy pressure. And so if you feel this light pressure about your performance and your actions, but heavy pressure about being honest and forthright and discussing things, then you're going to use that heavy pressure in the same way.

If you feel the heavy pressure about your performance and that everything has to be perfect, then you're going to project that onto the kids as well because. [00:06:00] All leadership is modeling behavior, and so you have , that opportunity to learn from those above you, and then to pass that on to those below you, and in education that is really highlighted clearly.

Yeah, and I think being vulnerable with middle school kids is, hard for some educators to get a full grasp of this because Elementary kids, in my opinion, they may not understand a lot of what adults go through. They're very innocent, but middle school kids are starting to get both sides of the fence.

They're starting to get a lot of the problems that adults project on them. I won't sit here and ever say that I don't have my, human moments where it's maybe I flew off the handle that I shouldn't have or whatever. But, I think that the most important part to my teaching and to my methods by teaching middle school is, Having an open door, they know a lot about me, , I know a lot about them, and if I have moments of, Being a human, whether it's flying off the handle, crying, whatever, with them, they'll see that it's okay to do that kind of stuff too.

I've actually done a really good job in 16 [00:07:00] years of holding back all of my tears. But it's, but different activities, it's hard because when, especially when you've had kids, , of your own that, and it seems like ever since I did have kids, I cry about everything but

kidding.

With middle school kids, if you shut them off to, getting to know you, then there's no way you're going to get to know them.

They just, they'll put that wall up the same way you do. And so I, will always say that they're going to know 90 percent about me. I always keep 10 percent to the cuff a little bit because there's just things that. Happen in your life that you don't necessarily have to always, , share with everybody because you don't share them with almost anybody.

But with middle school kids, I feel like they're most honest with the most honest teachers.

Yeah. And it comes back to this idea of being authentic, and if you're not being yourself or you're hiding something, then People see that, and kids especially, they see right through it, and they can tell when a teacher is like, giving a false answer, or a partly true answer, and, , the reality is, when we are clear about [00:08:00] things we're struggling with, and challenges that we face, , almost every time, people just respect us more, and appreciate us more, because we're being vulnerable, , if you can say, Hey, kids, I'm struggling today, and I'm mad, and I'm frustrated, I didn't have a good morning, Woke up on the wrong side of the bed, fought with my wife, my kids took forever to get out of the house, and I'm just on edge today.

And, that's where that co regulation then comes in, where they can be like, Hey, it's cool, , we can help you be better today. That kind of stuff is really powerful, and , if you're complaining about that every single day, that's different, right? But if you can be honest and vulnerable about a day you're struggling, kids respond to it in a positive way.

It's kind of funny. I tell kids all the time if you know me at all, like I'm not going to blow smoke. I'm going to tell you a straightforward, what I think. , at the same time, I don't try to make it so that it's just so harmful or so accepting , because I feel like when I speak to kids, especially middle school kids, I tell them all the things that I really do [00:09:00] enjoy about them, but if I'm having a one on one and their kid is struggling, I'm going to tell them flat out, this isn't going to work and I'm not talking about today, tomorrow, and next week.

I'm talking about, 20 years from now you will not keep a job acting like this, behaving like this, not doing your work. , but then I tell them, While I think 20 years in the future, you need to take a day at a time. Let's finish this week and make sure everything is done, and make sure we're not in the principal's office.

And then we'll take the whole next week and see. And I said , people aren't going to believe you if you're typically like this, but when you put 3 4 weeks together like this, now we start to see that change. I'm just big on trying to, figure out plans with kids and figure out , how I can transfer them to real life situations.

And I've shared things with them, like I said, that's allowed them to, relate more just because they can bring up their real life examples with me, too.

Yeah. So one of the things, the ways that I approach that is, I have a really hard time with [00:10:00] that.

This isn't going to work for you in the future. And I'll tell a quick story. I pulled my book cause I was going to, , read. From a part of it, which is really nerdy to do. And I apologize. So I won't do that, but here's the thing. I was told my whole entire life, Jethro, when you get into fourth grade, fifth grade, sixth grade, middle school, high school, college, your job, this kind of behavior is not going to fly.

And you know what everybody told me when you get someplace else, this kind of behavior is not going to fly. And you know what I learned? I learned that the behavior flies no matter where I want it to fly. Because some people are going to be upset, but they're just going to blame it on somebody else and say, you can't do this later.

And I've taken a little different approach, and what I say to kids is, You gotta learn how to play the game, because life is a game. Every part of it, no matter what. See it as a game, and you're just seeing if you're winning or if you're losing. And it's an infinite game, so there's really no winner or loser, but are you winning in the [00:11:00] moment?

And if you are miserable, your life sucks, you're mad, you're angry, you're frustrated, then you're losing. So what do you need to do to change how you're playing the game to be more successful? And I found that kids understand that a lot better, and they know we're lying when we say this isn't going to work in however many years.

Because the reality is, people behave that way, and they survive. And it's, eventually there's really no consequences for that kind of behavior. You just keep on going. And so I've always been a class clown. And I was a class clown in work, in school, all the time. And, people would always like, I had a boss, I would play these sound effects in meetings, on my iPad, because, , it was boring, and nobody liked it, and so I was just trying to liven it up, and he said that other people were complaining.

That was not true, I talked to everybody else on the team. Nobody was complaining, it was offending him, because he wasn't in control of the meeting, and he was [00:12:00] upset. And he said, this isn't going to fly if you ever want to be a principal. And I was like, you're so full of crap. That's just not true. I'm not playing the game that's going to win with you.

, you're my boss, I need to decide if I'm going to stick with you, or if I'm going to leave and go somewhere else where I can be who I want to be. And , helping them see the... The way they need to act to be successful wherever they're at is, I think, a really important piece. Any thoughts?

, I totally agree with you.

, I think the few times I've actually mentioned 20 years in the future, things like that, has been. Specific behaviors that I feel like when I know what they want to be or what they want to do, especially with all of the shift that Kansas is making for kids to be on their individual plans of study and what their field is.

I think that's why I bring that up, but , it's a great point because, , quite honestly, I've said similar, I haven't said game, but I've said similar things in terms of, , when you do get to the real world, there are going to be people [00:13:00] that love what you do. And are excited about the passion you bring to things , and I've told them, because this is my honesty with them, I've had principals that have not been okay with the way that I do things but I, but when I look at it down the road I said, I've built it.

Endless relationships with kids that no principal could ever take away from me, regardless of the situation. And much like you, I do love to entertain, I love to be funny, but I know there's always a time and place, where you can use it and where you can't, especially with something like sarcasm in middle school kids even though that's like their second language.

If you go past certain boundaries with that, you end up losing that kid. I 100 percent agree with you. I think that, that might be a better approach for anybody who might look at it from the standpoint of, hey, your future, depends on X, Y, and Z. But, that doesn't mean that you can't find the future that's going to fit your X, Y, and Z as well.

I think that's great.

I think you so much for being here, and I look [00:14:00] forward to... Chattin with you more. Is there a way you want people to connect with you or learn more from you?

Honestly you can always find my email address on the website for, Wamego Schools but it's just my last name, first letter at usd320. com. Spelling it out on the air could take way longer

That's right. It'll be in the title. You'll find it

yep but I'm always an open book and I even prefaced yesterday's talk with, I'm not gonna ever sit here and pretend like I'm an expert at everything, but I'm willing to share anything that's worked for me, I'm willing to talk about anything be challenged with stuff, and maybe take it back to my own team or to myself even and say, maybe I need to change this wording or different.

Approach to things. So, always available. I try to make myself available about at all times for people.

Cool.

Well, thanks so much for being on Resilient Schools and presenting here at Bridging to Resilience. Appreciate it.

for being on Resilient Schools and presenting here. Yeah. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. Thank you.